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Post by hally on Oct 30, 2013 18:42:22 GMT
Everyone ignored you last time you put that as well Pompeyman.
It's incorrect anyway, why does the fact you can't stand in the far terracing anymore stop me climbing over the fence???
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Post by fred on Nov 1, 2013 12:13:02 GMT
Is anyone at the club doing anything to try and get the stand reopened? All that seems to be happening is a wringing of hands and tut tuts!! Presumably the club has to pay rent for the use of the ground, so supposedly this has been substantially reduced due to the stand closure? If it hasn't the club should take the bull by the horns and withhold a significant amount. Surely it's the Elmbridge Council's duty to undertake repairs which should have happened long ago anyway!
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Post by 1066swan on Nov 8, 2013 11:20:10 GMT
Great fun, this Freedom of Information stuff.
Question: Is it the case that in the absence of any mutual agreement to the contrary the PRESENT Lease, or its implied extension after formal expiry, obliges the Council to repair the closed stand? Answer from Elmbridge BC: "It is the Council's responsibility" (I just wanted to nail that one)
Question: What was the cost of boarding over the closed stand? Answer from Elmbridge BC: £8,998 (excluding dismantling costs, I note)
Question: <please supply> copies of any e-mail, internal file note, memo, report to a higher manager, summarising what was told to Elmbridge BC in August by Mr Viney of the fire service - I find it very hard to accept that there is nothing of that nature written anywhere as otherwise the Council will have closed the stand and kept it closed based solely on a Council officer's unverified recollection of a conversation. Answer from Elmbridge BC: "Mr Viney did not provide any written report although he was asked to do so by Elmbridge Borough Council officers. A site meeting was held on 5 August 2013 when the recommendation was made to close the stand. There is no correspondence between Elmbridge Borough Council and the Fire Service"
I am still waiting for the Fire Service to respond to my FoI requests. Give them credit, Elmbridge BC are pretty fast to respond.
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Post by 1066swan on Nov 8, 2013 16:08:26 GMT
OK, here's some stuff in this afternoon from Surrey Fire:
<2 August, file note, Steve Viney> Following a number of queries from agencies in the past, I visited the above site in order to determine if the spectator accommodation on the far side of the pitch met the criteria for a ‘Regulated Stand’. I found a concrete stand with corrugated sheet metal roof and sides covering an area of 97m x 3.4m = 330m2, this stand was assessed against the criteria within Home Office Circular 97/1988 to determine if the standing spectator area should be a regulated stand. My decision is that it should, as the net area of 330m2 could accommodate 890 people using the afformentioned criteria. I have contacted Elmbridge Borough Council and requested an urgent meeting to discuss the way forward as it would appear that the football pitch is the subject of some planning proposals and may be moved to a nearby site. The stand is in a poor state of repair and have informed the owners that if certification is progressed there will undoubtedly be associated costs, I have also informed them that in my opinion the stand should not be used until remedial works have been undertaken. A section 10 notice has not been issued as I do not feel the very low number of occupants are in immediate risk, however, if following a decision from our meeting the roof is removed, this will negate the need for certification, albeit additional safety work will still be required for its continued use. I am awaiting contact with EBC to arrange this meeting, following which I will progress the matter. _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ <File note, Steve Viney, 5 August> I met and discussed with EBC officials the issues surrounding the covered terrace at Walton & Hersham FC. I provided advice as to what immediate works may be required under the guidance if the local authority wanted to continue with certification and use of the terrace for spectator accommodation. I answered numerous questions in response to their options for the future and agreed that within ten days Elmbridge Borough Council would respond to me with their decision. As they have opted to keep the covered terrace closed for the immediate future until a decision is made, I agreed to await their response before initiating the certification process. __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
<Although supplied by Surrey Fire this next one appears to be a letter from Elmbridge to the Club> 23rd August 2013 By Registered Post
Mr XXXXX XXXXX XXXXX • Surrey
Dear XXX
RE: STOMPOND LANE COVERED STAND
I write further to my various letters and e-mails with regard to the above matter and am writing to advise you of our proposed action
We have looked at the various options that have been given to us by Surrey Fire and Rescue Service and we have concluded that the safest and best way forward for this stand is to "board it up" so that it cannot be used at all We will happily work with you to ensure that the advertisements on the current stand are relocated and that the hoarding is made as presentable as possible We apologise for any inconvenience this may cause you but I am sure you understand that We must ensure the public's safety is paramount In our decision to close off this stand
We will commence these works as soon as practically possible and will advise you as soon as we have a commencement date on site The project will be managed by officers in Asset Management Property Services and if you have any queries please do let me know
In the meantime, I would be grateful if you could provide me with a copy of your fire action plan for spectators as requested m my letter of 6th August 2013
Yours sincerely
Alex Williams
Cc Steve Viney- Surrey Fire and Rescue Service George Clarkson - Surveyor Asset Management and Property Services ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
<this one dated 11 September, I think we have already known about>
Dear Mr XXXX,
In response to your query regarding the covered terrace at Stompond Lane, I can confirm that Surrey Fire and Rescue Service as the enforcing authority on behalf of Surrey County Council for the Fire Safety and Safety of Places of Sport Act i987, visited Stompond Lane in response to previous queries relating to the status of the covered terrace On inspection it was determined through applying the appropriate criteria that this terrace should be a regulated stand and therefore require a safety certificate Elmbridge Borough Council (ESC) as the owner were contacted and given time to consider their options, during which time they closed the stand pending their decision Some two weeks later I was informed that the ESC senior management team had decided to permanently board-up the covered terrace from future use I duly issued ESC with a determination notice stating that any reversal of this decision would require an application for a general safety certificate covering its use as a regulated stand At no point have Surrey Fire and Rescue Service prohibited or restricted the use of this terrace, ESC as the owner have made this decision themselves and would suggest only they can provide the real reasons for not progressing along the certification route and continued use of the terrace as a regulated stand Should you have any further queries please do not hesitate in contacting me
Regards
Steve Viney, Fire Safety/ Sports Ground Coordinator, Walton Area Office, East Area Surrey Fire and Rescue Service
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Post by hally on Nov 9, 2013 11:06:29 GMT
Have any of these people ever been to a game at The Lane?? Clearly not. The most you ever get in there is approx 50 people (bar exceptional circumstances ie AFC Wimbledon, Aldershot, Swansea) and usually it's more like 20. Such a safety risk it's untrue......
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Post by hally on Nov 9, 2013 11:06:53 GMT
Top work though 1066Swan, find investigating
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Post by hally on Nov 9, 2013 11:07:18 GMT
Fine even
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Post by 1066swan on Nov 26, 2013 11:39:52 GMT
Seen a picture from today with the terracing now all boarded up which apparently cost £15000!! Some things in life just beggar belief £9,000 actually
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Post by 1066swan on Nov 26, 2013 11:45:44 GMT
Elmbridge Borough Council advise that the necessary work would have been complete replacement of the stand and also moving it back.
Elmbridge Borough Council did not get any second opinion. They have relied solely on the verbal opinion of the Fire Service, who have consistently failed to confirm this in writing.
Neither Football Club nor Athletics Club have yet responded to the Council's August request for information on safety procedures.
Just plain stinks all round.
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Post by johnc on Nov 26, 2013 12:38:30 GMT
as landlord its up to the council to provide these plans not the tennants
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Post by 1066swan on Nov 26, 2013 14:54:48 GMT
as landlord its up to the council to provide these plans not the tennants Then perhaps the club should communicate that view to the landlords?
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Post by fred on Nov 27, 2013 11:10:20 GMT
This is pathetic! The Council are obviously hiding behind the situation and whilst they seemed happy enough to splash out almost £10,000 for some numpties to come along and board it up, why, as landlords, did they avoid their responsibilities to repair the stand several years ago? The simple answer has to be that they decided some time ago that they wanted the football and athletic clubs out and away so they could use the land for housing development and get some serious profits into their coffers! They went through the motions of "consultation" procedures but the issue had already been rubber stamped previously! Why on earth did the football and athletics clubs not respond to the safety certificate issue; we have hardly helped ourselves by ignoring the Council's requests! In fact we have played right into the Council's hands! All very well for John c to try and pass the buck, but the football club has yet again demonstrated apathy and lack of action! Probably too late now to rectify the situation and sadly it looks as if it's a case of self inflicted wounds as the Swans seem forced to unfortunately share a ground with the Casuals and have the hassle of trying to make that work somehow!! It seems as if such a proposition will be a nightmare to make it viable!
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Post by johnc on Nov 27, 2013 13:17:58 GMT
I was only reporting fact, unlike your rant
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Post by fred on Nov 27, 2013 17:05:33 GMT
Understand John c wasn't having a go at you personally but the whole scenario concerning the stand closure is a source of great indignation for all the supporters! Delighted to at last hear that James Cameron is officially appointed as manager; I wish him well and every success!
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